This is due to the fact that the bookmarks are stored within an SQLite database, within your profile directory, and any modifications within Firefox merely change your view within Firefox and does not modify the database. Modifying the location of information in the database is bit more complicated since software, like Firefox, is programmed to look for things in certain places. There's no simple way to change this functionality.

This is a great reason to use the search feature at the top of the bookmark menu(Ctrl+B), so it doesn't matter where your bookmarks are located.

That just bites! I know there a lot of people like me that want their bookmarks to be sorted. I don't want to type in a query to find my bookmark, I want it where I put it! So I am signing out of Sync. I'll sync my computers once a month. That is about how often I will ACCEPT having to re-sort.

Suggestion, disconnect both devices before you sort your bookmarks on both devices. Then before you connect both those devices back to Sync, change your Firefox Account password, to clear your Sync data from the Sync server; then connect one device back to the Sync server "to feed" a fresh load of data. Then after a few hours connect the 2nd device to Sync again. Best not to rearrange a massive number Bookmarks when Firefox is connected to the Sync server; especially when another device also had Firefox running and connected to the Sync server.

See if that works better for you.

Also, the matter of how you are doing an alpha sort. If you're using the Library window - Views > Sort -> Sort by name or Sort A to Z Sort Order. That is a temporary Sort view of your bookmarks' close the Library window and the "sort" is gone. Views > Sort doesn't provide a "permanent sort", just a "view" of an alpha sort.

Sorry if you were already aware of that, but with you posting from a new SUMO account I felt this explanation was warranted. BTW, the user account I am using here is new as of 6 weeks ago when this forum's software was reverted back to the old software to fix some "issues".

I figured out the library view is temporary. Also, I find no way to sort the main bookmark menu, so I've been doing it by hand. Hence my irritation over it being wiped out each time Sync does its job.

I have a much easier and less annoying way to sync my bookmarks. It's the way I did it before using sync. I save the bookmarks from the computer I use the most as an html file. I then go to the other, open Firefox and delete the entire bookmark menu. I then read the html file in and both computers are synced and sorted. I find it strictly BS the the users have to figure out their own ways to make sync work the way it should. If it doesn't work right, don't put it out there.

The few times that I have done an alpha sort or Sort by Name, I have done it in the Bookmarks Sidebar and I limited it to between certain Separators. I don't like fully alpha sorted bookmarks; I prefer most accessed at the top with the lesser used ones near the bottom, as it saves time when scrolling down the sidebar. And I prefer using the Bookmarks Sidebar to the Bookmarks "button", a holdover from my days using Internet Explorer up until I started using Firefox in 2002. And in all but one of my Firefox Profiles, I don't use the Bookmarks Toolbar, as it is a waste of "real estate" for me. The Navigation Toolbar is the only toolbar that I need showing all the time.

Right-click and use Sort by Name. That will provide a permanent sort, with folders coming first followed by any loose bookmarks but only at the same level; the individual bookmarks won't get sorted. From there the user would need to sort each individual folder one at a time. The deeper you make the folder structure the more "sorting operations" the user would need to do. If the user would add Separators via the contextual menu, the "sort" is limited and will stop at the next Separator.

IMO, Sync is very problematic. And with every "improvement" it seems that unexpected "faults" appear. I use for Sync ended as Mozilla was preparing Sync to be a standard part of Firefox (in Firefox 4.0) when Mozilla didn't make it backwards compatible with the Weave extension (Firefox 3.0 thru 3.6) which was used to test "Sync" before making it part of Firefox 4.0 .

I was using Weave with my desktop and a EeePC NetBook, which couldn't handle Firefox 4.0 even a different Linux "flavor" that was made specifically for the EeePC by the "EeePC community"; plus Mozilla kept doing security updates for Firefox 3.6 for close to a year, but Weave was never "fixed" to be compatible with the Sync server.

After that I had no real use for Sync after that, but I did continue to "play with" Sync until about a year ago on my desktop alone by using multiple Profiles that I was using for testing the Nightly pre-release version against the Release version. "Part of me" wanted to keep up with Sync and watch it as Mozilla continued to try to improve it; and I was frequently disappointed when an "improvement" also brought a shortcoming or two that didn't exist before the "improvement" was made.

As far the big picture with the usage of Sync among long time Firefox users and those who provide support in this forum - not one person who's been around since 2007 / 8 when this forum went live, that I recognize as a regular contributor to support here even uses Sync anymore.

Overall, I like your ideas about using the HTML exported file for the other device, but I'm warning you that it may not work the same "forever". The HTML format for bookmarks has already been removed from Firefox for the default bookmarks that come with Firefox, and also for the default bookmarks when a new Profile is created. It hasn't appeared in a new Profile or in a new installation for over a year or maybe closer to 2 years now. With the changes to Firefox that started around Firefox 40 or 41 to get rid of old unused code and update all API's that continues today, and with the biggest changes coming by or in Firefox 57 when only Web Extensions will work in Firefox, and the removal of XUL, I would be surprised if the HTML format survives the "scalpel".

the-edmeister-3 said

"The few times that I have done an alpha sort or Sort by Name, I have done it in the Bookmarks Sidebar" "I don't use the Bookmarks Toolbar, as it is a waste of "real estate" for me. The Navigation Toolbar is the only toolbar that I need showing all the time."

What, the sidebar isn't a waste of space?!?

Right-click and use Sort by Name. That will provide a permanent sort,

I cannot find a menu selection to sort the main bookmark menu (folder). The sub-folders have the option when you right click on them to sort the sub-folder. Every attempt I have made over the years (I've been using FoxFire since Internet Explorer 8 came out) has only sorted sub-folders (or menus as they are called in the Foxfire docs).

I was using Weave with my desktop and a EeePC NetBook

I thought I was the only person that ever bought one of those. ;)

As far the big picture with the usage of Sync among long time Firefox users and those who provide support in this forum - not one person who's been around since 2007 / 8 when this forum went live, that I recognize as a regular contributor to support here even uses Sync anymore.

That seems like Mozilla is only making it to suit themselves, not the end user. If all their most experienced users don't use it, it doesn't seem as if Mozilla even cares about what the end users want. If they did, sort would be easier and users could sort by a number of factors. I personally prefer alphabetical.

Overall, I like your ideas about using the HTML exported file for the other device, but I'm warning you that it may not work the same "forever". The HTML format for bookmarks has already been removed from Firefox for the default bookmarks that come with Firefox, and also for the default bookmarks when a new Profile is created. It hasn't appeared in a new Profile or in a new installation for over a year or maybe closer to 2 years now. With the changes to Firefox that started around Firefox 40 or 41 to get rid of old unused code and update all API's that continues today, and with the biggest changes coming by or in Firefox 57 when only Web Extensions will work in Firefox, and the removal of XUL, I would be surprised if the HTML format survives the "scalpel".

When that happens, I go back to IE. I've been irritated with Firefox along for not offering a choice to close the current tab when the users gets a bit air headed and hits the close button when they just wanted to close the current tab. If they take away the only way for me to sync my bookmarks that works every time, the way I want it too, I'm done!

I'd never consider Chrome because Google is single-handedly trying to eliminate personal privacy. Safari for the PC isn't as good as it is for my iPhone or iPad. And Edge, that is lacking any kind of refinements at all, so IE will be it.

Mike.

Quote: I cannot find a menu selection to sort the main bookmark menu (folder).

You can do this in the left pane in the Bookmarks Manager (Library).

• Bookmarks menu or "Show your bookmarks" button -> Show All Bookmarks

cor-el said

Quote: I cannot find a menu selection to sort the main bookmark menu (folder). You can do this in the left pane in the Bookmarks Manager (Library).

• Bookmarks menu or "Show your bookmarks" button -> Show All Bookmarks

Yes, I know about that, however, as pointed out above, this is a temporary view, it doesn't last. Right clicking on a (sub)folder menu and choosing sort is permanent. I find no option for such a permanent sort for the main listing.

I think you misunderstood. You need to right-click the "Bookmarks Menu" folder in the left pane in the Bookmarks Manager (Library). There you will see a "Sort By Name" item that will sort the content to the Bookmarks Menu folder.

cor-el said

I think you misunderstood. You need to right-click the "Bookmarks Menu" folder in the left pane in the Bookmarks Manager (Library). There you will see a "Sort By Name" item that will sort the content to the Bookmarks Menu folder.

I understand just fine. When you do it your way and Firefox syncs with my other computer, it all gets unsorted. When I sort the sub-folders while in the bookmark "menu", they stay sorted during the next sync process. When I sort ANY FOLDERS in the library view, they become unsorted at the next sync. I want a process that does NOT force me to resort my bookmarks to be able to easily find what I am looking for. This is a very POORLY programmed "feature" (BUG!).

Don't take my word for it, try it yourself.

IMO, you're better off if you TURN OFF Sync when you do a sort. And you might want to do the sort on all devices (with Sync turned off) if you have many, many bookmarks. Less work for Sync, which IMO sometimes needs a few opening and closings of Firefox to "sync" all the changes to all devices.

Honestly, I haven't used Sync for almost ten years for anything important; my experience with Sync is with "test" Profiles so I can keep up with the changes to Sync that have come over time. And those "test" Profiles are strictly used for testing pre-release versions vs a basic latest Release version; I rarely save any new bookmarks to any "test" Profile.

As far as opening and closing the Bookmarks Sidebar, I use my left hand little finger and index finger to hit {Ctrl + B} to open and then close the Bookmarks Sidebar and use my right-hand on the mouse to select the bookmark that I want to open.

the-edmeister-3 said

IMO, you're better off if you TURN OFF Sync when you do a sort. And you might want to do the sort on all devices (with Sync turned off) if you have many, many bookmarks. Less work for Sync, which IMO sometimes needs a few opening and closings of Firefox to "sync" all the changes to all devices.

If you re-read my initial posting, you'll see I do just that.

Honestly, I haven't used Sync for almost ten years for anything important;

This is all academic at this point since I've stopped using sync altogether and I am trying out other browsers. The only thing I actually like about Firefox is the ability to save my bookmarks as an HTML file. From your earlier message, it sounds like soon that feature will be eliminated, at which point I will no longer have any use for Firefox. I am loyal to a product only as long as it stays in line with my usage and Firefox has done NOTHING to make my browsing life easier. Lately, Firefox seems too much like Windows. They make "improvements" that remove some of my usability, and call it "better".

I use my left hand little finger and index finger to hit {Ctrl + B} to open and then close the Bookmarks Sidebar

Way too much extra effort just to get to my bookmarks. Like I said, I am trying out other browsers. It has been at least 7 years since I did that last, I am hoping for an improvement in one of the others (except Chrome, screw Google).

I've been growing more and more unhappy with Firefox over the last couple of years.

RMikeS said

I've been irritated with Firefox along for not offering a choice to close the current tab when the users gets a bit air headed and hits the close button when they just wanted to close the current tab.

That is indeed an annoyance, which can be easily fixed :

Type in the address bar   about:config  (press Enter) (promise to be careful, if asked) Type and look for the preference : browser.tabs.warnOnClose and make sure its value is set to   true

Maybe this is obvious but

1. You can freeze the alpha sort order by copying that selection.
2. Firefox has advanced on the fly search methods with special characters, and that can be quite handy for finding bookmarks.
   • See Address bar autocomplete suggestions in Firefox_changing-results-on-the-fly

• Tabs warning is also settable from the Menu Startup, home page, tabs, and download settings_tabs

Regarding 1) above If you let the bookmarks manager sort the bookmarks for you, and then cut and copy those sorted bookmarks that will become the order of the unsorted bookmarks. Once all the bookmarks are sorted to your satisfaction manually add any new bookmarks and put them in the correct position. Not sure that will help with Sync messing up the order however, it should enable you to keep your bookmarks in the alpha order you want.

As for some of these issues not being developed or fixed I guess it is a case of priorities. The bookmarks alpha sort issue is probably not considered a priority due to the ease of finding bookmarks or temporarily & rapidly resorting them. Sync issues would probably require a complete rethink and rewrite to solve some of the known issues.

Happy112 said

That is indeed an annoyance, which can be easily fixed :
Type in the address bar   about:config  (press Enter) (promise to be careful, if asked) Type and look for the preference : browser.tabs.warnOnClose and make sure its value is set to   true

That was already set to true.

What I was saying above is that the last time I used IE, if I went to the upper right corner and pressed the main close button and had more than one tab open, it would ask me if I MEANT to close all tabs or just the active tab. I always loved that. I press the main close button ALL THE TIME. I don't mean to, I just do it. It would be great if Firefox gave me the choice of closing JUST the active tab. That was the one thing about IE that I missed immediately when I started looking for a different browser.

John99 said

Maybe this is obvious but

1. You can freeze the alpha sort order by copying that selection.

Not obvious at all!

Regarding 1) above If you let the bookmarks manager sort the bookmarks for you, and then cut and copy those sorted bookmarks that will become the order of the unsorted bookmarks

What do you mean by this? Where are you copying to? Do I then need to delete the originals? If this was to work, it would make me very happy.

1. Firefox has advanced on the fly search methods with special characters, and that can be quite handy for finding bookmarks.
   • See Address bar autocomplete suggestions in Firefox_changing-results-on-the-fly

I have no intention of typing a query to find a bookmark that should always be in the same location, just 2 clicks away. I don't understand why I can permanently sort the sub-menus (folders) and not the main menu (folder). My sub folder sorts survive being synced. It is the main bookmark menu that gets unsorted EVERY TIME Firefox syncs my devices. WTF?!?

• Tabs warning is also settable from the Menu Startup, home page, tabs, and download settings_tabs

This only gives a warning about asking if you wish to close ALL tabs at once or don't close any. I'd like it to ask that, but I also wish it to give me the option of closing JUST THE ACTIVE tab. I know it's a little thing, but it was the thing I liked best about IE.

As for some of these issues not being developed or fixed I guess it is a case of priorities. The bookmarks alpha sort issue is probably not considered a priority due to the ease of finding bookmarks or temporarily & rapidly resorting them.

Only the sub-menus are easy to re-sort. It takes only 2 CLICKS to do a permanent sort. Anything else is too much effort for a bookmark menu that changes the sort with EVERY SINGLE SYNC BETWEEN DEVICES. To get a sort in the main menu, since there are no right click menus to ease the process, I hand sort the main menu. I make it alphabetical, with 4 frequently used bookmarks (sorted) right at the top of the list.

When I finally decided to trust Firefox enough to try a sync, I expected it to make it easier for me to share bookmarks between devices. Having to re-sort EVERY SINGLE TIME, completely negates the advantage of the syncing operation because it is more work than passing a text message to the other computer containing any links I've added, so I can add them there.

Sync issues would probably require a complete rethink and rewrite to solve some of the known issues.

Isn't that what revisions are for? You make sound like a big deal, but as a programmer myself, I know the entire project doesn't need to be re-done, just the function that is the problem. The remaining code can be the same as long as the new code conforms to the rules of the remaining code. I just don't get why they would supply a cool feature like sync, and not make it EASY to use. If they don't care about it enough to do that, why supply it at all?

This problem where my bookmarks are unsorted has been driving me crazy also, ESPECIALLY my bookmarks toolbar. I have bookmarks I use repeatedly on a daily basis and it should be click click and instead they expect me to search for them every time, it's ridiculous! Why allow us to change the order if it won't save it?

RMikeS said

I am loyal to a product only as long as it stays in line with my usage and Firefox has done NOTHING to make my browsing life easier. Lately, Firefox seems too much like Windows. They make "improvements" that remove some of my usability, and call it "better".

I've been growing more and more unhappy with Firefox over the last couple of years.

I couldn't have said it better myself and this is the exact reason I stopped using IE, they kept taking away features I used and called it progress. I WILL move on to a different browser if this trend continues.

When Norton's Identity safe stopped working with Firefox for a year, and Norton and Mozilla pointed the blame at each other, I just replaced it with LastPass. No sense in wasting time with something that doesn't work for me and I won't hesitate to replace Firefox either.