I don't know what has changed, but in the meantime you could change the Offline settings in Preferences to have TB start in offline mode.

Thank you sfhowes. Do you mean in Preferences > Offline > Manual State when starting up ....and select "offline"?

Yes, try that.

Thank you, that certainly stops the download when I first open TBird (brings up the message that I'm offline and do i want to go online) but after the that with TBird still open messages continue to come through without me using "Get Messages". I was wondering whether the "Port" or "Connection Security" settings needed to be changed, but looking at the "server settings" page I see that they are the same as in Mailwasher. Thee "Authentication Method" is showing as "OAuth2" - should that be "Normal Password"?

Tell me if this is inappropriate and I'll start a new question, but one other thing I notice with the setup, under each email address on the left I have of course "Inbox" but further down in folders I also have "All Mail" and unopened messages are auto migrating into that folder from the inbox. Is that normal or can i get rid of "All Mail" and keep messages in the Inbox until i'm ready to move them? If I change it now will i lose any?

All Mail is a gmail folder, and most users unsubscribe it, since its contents are found in other folders. See the All Mail section here (view the cached Google version if the site is down). The relevant part, copied here:

Gmail IMAP accounts have a All Mail folder which tracks every message. This is an artifact of how Gmail implemented labels, not a Thunderbird quirk. That folder is also used as the archive folder.

Tools -> Account Settings -> Gmail -> Synchronization & Storage -> Advanced is configured to keep a local copy of all IMAP folders on your hard disk. From a performance point of view you may wish to unsubscribe All Mail. The safe way to unsubscribe and free the related disk space is:

Uncheck it in Synchronization & Storage -> Advanced Unsubscribe it (right-click the account, Subscribe...) Press the "open folder" button in Help -> Troubleshooting Information -> Profile Folder to view the profile directory using Windows Explorer. Exit Thunderbird. Go to ..\ImapMail\imap.gmail.com (or ..\ImapMail\imap.googlemail.com if you use the googlemail mail server) Delete both "All Mail." and "All Mail.msf". Restart Thunderbird.

The correct setting for gmail authentication is OAuth2.

Sfhowes - pity I don't have a first name to address you. Looking back i see you also helped me 2 yeras ago with my query about importing an address book. So I've been taking up a lot of your time and I appreciate it, but I'm starting to think that I should uninstall and start again!

In terms of your last message, yes thanks, your advice worked and I was able to remove the "All Mail" folders in my 2 main accounts.I am however continuing to have problems with emails in Thunderbird: to recap, I use "MailwasherPro" to check mail before I download it into TBird. However new emails were simply downloading themselves without mw clicking on "Get Messages". You recommended going offline until I was ready to see the new emails. That worked, but after TBird was open and online any new messages arriving would once more download immediately into the program, thus bypassing the MailwasherPro filter. I decided to cancel the offline and revert to normal.

I came back to the PC at lunchtime to find 5 new emails in MailwasherPro. As soon as I opened TBird they once again immediately arrived in my Inbox without me clicking "Get Messages". I opened the first new email and before I read it all 5 disappeared from my Inbox and I can't find them anywhere, having searched all of my folders

I've been content using TBird for a number of years and would not want to find an alternative, but something is clearly wrong with my setup. I don't want to keep bothering you with this, but should I save the "Profile" file and uninstall/re-install or would that profile simply keep all the current settings which are not working properly?

Geoff

If an account, such as gmail, supports PUSH notifications, TB downloads new messages when they arrive at the mail server, so even by disabling all checking in TB, new mail will still arrive.

I'm not familiar with MailWasher, but I think you might temporarily disable it and see if TB works properly. It might be that MW is incompatible with TB 91. You may find that gmail's built-in spam filters are adequate, if not superior.

Uninstall/reinstall won't fix a problem with the profile, but creating a new one from Help/More Troubleshooting, about:profiles, might be worthwhile. The current profile would be unaffected.

I've closed down Mailwasher and started TBird, but the same problem occurred, new emails download without me taking any action. I'll look into creating a new profile tomorrow afternoon when i have time, but I have to say my inclination now is to use a different email client.

just curious here, but exactly what benefit to you get from using mailwasher? I have looked hard at it and I see none at all however it appears to remain popular.

Morning Matt. It's about confidence. I started using MW long ago, I think it must be over 15 years because I wanted the security of knowing that I was protected (as far as possible) from spam, viruses and unwanted ADs. It became habit and I still like to see what's on the server and have the opportunity to choose what i want and don't want before it arrives in my Inbox. I've also been very pleased with their customer support, which has been prompt and in a very friendly tone. As it happens the guy who has been helping me with this current setup on my new PC also uses TBird. He speaks well of it but of course uses MW alongside. My TB settings appear to be the same as his but he does not have the problems I've encountered.

I once more suspended use of MW overnight and started TB without MW but the same issue occurred, messages downloading to the Inbox without me doing anything. I accept that most problems occur because of user error but I just can't fathom what I've done. I better go over my account settings and preferences once more before I move to another email client.

Geoff

re: messages downloading to the Inbox without me doing anything. That is normal. You have an imap gmail account. All the folders synchronise with server to show what is on serve - yes this can be switched off. However, new mail is auto pushed by gmail and will get downloaded or just headers downloaded depending upon settings - if Thunderbird is running in online mode.

According to MailWasher you do Not open Thunderbird until you have used mailwasher... https://www.firetrust.com/products/mailwasher-pro/quick-start-guide Mailwasher says:

• Open MailWasher
• Click, Check Mail,
• Mark your email for deletion or keeping,
• Click Wash Mail
• Then you open, (or Mailwasher Opens ) your email program,
• Click Send/Receive in your email program to check for new mail like normal.

So it basically means, do not open Thunderbird until you have already checked Mailwasher, then download to Thunderbird and then Thunderbird has to go into offline mode to stop auto synchronisation of imap folders or ability to receive push mail which is normal for gmail imap. Then at some point you go back to checking in Mailwasher, when done, swap Thunderbird to online mode - download and then go back to offline mode. Repeat.

So if you want to use Mailwasher you have to use the process they advise as stated above.

Sounds inconvenient and laborious and does not add any value or additional safety - you still have to check all the spam for stuff that is not spam then delete it using mailwasher.

Spam in gmail get auto emptied by gmail every 30 days by default although you can empty spam earlier and there are settings in Thunderbird to do this.

Gmail spam filter is good and there is also the Junk filter in Thunderbird which can be trained. Thunderbird by default does not allow remote content to be displayed. You have to change settings in order to actually allow that and it is not recommended. Only you can decide to open an attachment, so do not open an attachment just for curiosity.

There is no reason to need Mailwasher but if you want to use it then you have to abide by the methods Mailwasher say you have to use. You cannot have Thunderbird running in online mode if you want Mailwasher to access emails first.

There is quite alot of good info/help: https://www.firetrust.com/products/mailwasher-pro/support/frequently-asked-questions#can-i-use-yahoogmailhotmailaol-with-mailwasher-pro

Quote: Yes you can:

In GMail: • Click Settings > Forwarding and POP > POP Download > Check Enable POP only for mail that arrives from now on.

ADDED NOTE: It might be advisable to use select 'Enable POP for all mail' if you have not previously got copies of all emails into 'Local Folders' mail account.

• Go to: When messages are accessed with POP and choose Delete Gmails copy. • Click Save changes. In MailWasher Pro: • Click Settings Tab > Accounts > Add Email Account. • Enter a name reference for your account in the Account Description and enter your GMail address in to the Email Address field. Click Save. • The Gmail details will be added automatically, but see the Gmail password requirements to get MailWasher working • Click Save.

unquote

Notice how Mailwasher are very specific about you using a gmail POP account. POP accounts use Fetch mail - Perhaps that is the difference in the Gmail settings. Note: You cannot simply swap server settings in Thunderbird to change from imap to pop. You would need to remove the imap account and then create new exisitng mail account for gmail email address and set up as a POP account.

Then disable the 'Server Settings' in POP account before you run get messages. : 'Check for new messages at startup' 'check for new mesasges every x minutes' 'Automatically download new mail'

Thank you T.H. Your points about push mail and offline settings were also made earlier by "Sfhowes" above in the chain. If you look back at the first question i raised you'll note that this problem started with a new installation of TBird on this new PC, my previous PC having suffered damage to the hard drive. When i was composing my question I noticed from different questions raised by other people that problems were occurring with new installations. As I've not had a problem with TBird and MW working together for several years, I'm now inclined to believe that the current problem arose from some changes in the new TBird version.

As a matter of interest I will have a look at the ink you sent about, but my local tech shop has now managed to recover my previous TBird profile which was on the damaged hard drive. Using TBird Profile Manager I have managed to set that up in TBird and i can see alll the folders and emails which existed at the time of the crash. My new profile of course can also be sen in Profile manager, do you know of any way to merge the 2? If not I guess I can save the old messages to an external drive then copy and paste them back to the new TBird installation.

As for MWPro you will have seen from my reply to Matt above, it will be hard to give it up after so many years of happily using it. My current licence runs until January, and I'll have to consider it.

Geoff

Thank you to everyone who helped with the chain of queries. This is to let you know of my appreciation and also to say that the Tech shop was eventually able to retireve all of my previous TBird folders, emails and adress books from the SSD drive which became damaged (after just 2 years' usage!).

I am reasonably happy now that I have been able to transfer my original data back to the current setup and have saved the profile in Dropbox. I'll do so regularly now. I'm getting used to working with TBird offline but I notice that some messages which contain images display the images when opened but one or two do not. I can live with that at the moment.

So the only issue remains is one i asked about earlier but i don't think it was addressed - new emails arrive in TBird, if I don't attach a star or move them to a folder, they simply disappear from the inbox a very short while after I have read them. Can anybody can help with that please?