Still sticking. Also getting weird blank emails in the local inbox. At one point I got duplicate mails downloaded .. possibly when I manually ran the filter. And a new message arriving did not unstick it.

and it seems to be in a real mess ... it claims to be downloading 2 of 5 when it knows there are 19 in the IMAP copy folder.

https://support.cdn.mozilla.net/media/uploads/images/2015-11-30-08-55-26-fdef73.png

You mention that this filtering moving emails into Inbox has worked ok for years, but clearly something has changed because you are using Win10 which has not been around that long. when did you swap over to win10? You would have had to setup new existing mail accounts or copy over a profile.

re :and it seems to be in a real mess ... it claims to be downloading 2 of 5 when it knows there are 19 in the IMAP copy folder.

The top listed mail account shows 19 unread emails in the Inbox. The number 19 refers to unread mail already downloaded. the status bar says 'downloading 2 of 5 in Inbox', but does not state the account, so I'm assuming you know that it is refering to the top mail account Inbox. In the current batch, there were 5 emails to be downloaded of which it is currently downloading the second. What is being currently downloaded and what has previously been downloaded are not the same.

Re POP account only: Is the filtering/moving downloaded emails on the POP mail account working ok ? Is this top listed mail account, a POP mail account ? Which one is the pop mail account?

Is the problem only on the IMAP mail account(s)? Is the imap account only the gmail account?

The auto filter process occurs on 'new unread' mail that is being downloaded not on 'unread' mail previously downloaded.

Please note that if you have viewed those emails via another method eg: webmail or phone or another computer then it will no longer be considered as new unread mail and so may not get filtered. Have you viewed any of those emails via something other than Thunderbird on that computer?

re :Also getting weird blank emails in the local inbox This really does sound like those emails have come from an imap mail account. Generally. imap mail accounts only download headers to Thunderbird and the rest is downloaded to a temp cache when the email is selected. Nothing is actually stored in the Thunderbird profile.

Synchronising subscribed folders should get the entire message downloaded and copied to eg: the Thunderbird mail account Inbox. So, I presume this is the method you have been using.

If only headers had been downloaded and the filter acted upon them then they would be blank when opened in the 'Local Folders' Inbox because it does not interact with the server to download the rest.

Alternatively, the emails had not been fully downloaded before the filter was moving emails or maybe another program was interfering with the process, like an anti-virus/firewall product.

Please check to see if your anti-virus/firewall product is scanning incoming mail. What anti-virus/firewall product do you use ? Is it scanning incoming wemail ?

Thanks for your detailed response. It gives me some useful background - I had assumed that the download from to the ISP inbox would be complete and the copy to local inbox would be instant - it has always been so quick as not to notice where any lag occurred. Win 10 update was about 2 months ago (same machine) and yes I have a mobile K9Mail that reads, but leaves unmarked, the mails at the ISP. That has worked for a long time too. The more I looked at it, the more it seemed that there was one basic problem - the emails were taking an age to download and other things then had time to interfere in the process - such as me manually dragging emails from one folder to another when it stalled ( which is where I now think the empty mails came from) . For some 6 emails, it was taking about 20 minutes to download with the green busy bar showing. This begain to smell like corruption if there were no recent changes to TBird.

I decided to be brave and rebuild completely. Fortunately I keep my large local folders separately and keep an automatic daily/weekly/monthly backup. So I uninstalled, reinstalled, made sure the inboxes were empty and 'repaired' them from the properties dialog. I manually entered all the ISP data and relinked the local folders ( again 'repairing' the inbox). Test mails seem to be working but I am holding my enthusiasm until a large batch come through :-)

You give me one concern though which, on the face of it sounds like bad design... 'If only headers had been downloaded and the filter acted upon them then they would be blank when opened in the 'Local Folders' Inbox because it does not interact with the server to download the rest.' Surely the filter process ought to wait if the message is not complete?

Once again - thanks for detailed reply. Gareth

re :You give me one concern though which, on the face of it sounds like bad design... 'If only headers had been downloaded and the filter acted upon them then they would be blank when opened in the 'Local Folders' Inbox because it does not interact with the server to download the rest.' Surely the filter process ought to wait if the message is not complete?

Depends..have you setup the imap subscribed folders to be synchronised to keep a copy locally in Thunderbird?

• https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/imap-synchronization#w_configuring-synchronization-and-disk-space-usage

In Account Settings > Synchroization & storage for the imap mail account also check the 'Advanced' button to see folders are selected. Please confirm the imap mail account is set up to store locally.

Have you tried switching off email scanning to see if this improves the download speed ?

Yes, synchronised including the imap mail account. Norton is configured to scan inbound and outbound. Not keen on turning that off - and this is unchanged, apart from possible updates from Norton of course. Adaptive junk scan is also on - happy to turn that off and have done so.

I had the auto filter to copy to local back on but given the result just now, I am turning them off again ... you will see that several mails came down empty ( but had been readable in my phone with K9mail) - and yours came twice as a bonus :-(

https://support.cdn.mozilla.net/media/uploads/images/2015-12-01-09-19-28-8eef08.png

From your comments earlier, I am inclined to change the IMAP account to use their POP server if it is still available. Would you agree - or is there benefit to either of us (or other users) in trying to bottom out this problem - I can't be the only one with this configuration :-)

Please start *Windows'* safe mode with networking enabled - win10 http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-10/change-startup-settings-in-windows-10

Still In Windows safe mode, start thunderbird in safe mode - http://support.mozillamessaging.com/en-US/kb/safe-mode

Does problem go away?

That seems to behave ok. I sent 3 medium sized messages ( each with a couple of the images above ) - they downloaded and the filter to inbox worked ok.

also - and possibly significantly, the dragging of messages from the ISP inbox to the local inbox works ok in safe mode. For background - the only add-on I have added is QuickText which I have used for a long time

OK - several hours of testing various combinations later (guess who is a retired systems tester :-) )

Windows 10 in Safe Mode; TBird in safe mode. Comparing webmail (demon tell me this is also IMAP) access to demon ISP with TBird access via IMAP -- and comparing with Gmail POP access in TBird. Sent 2 large emails to demon (600K) - instantly readable in the webmail; TBird is downloading 20 minutes now and counting . [last night it was some hours for 3 of these messages ] One copy to Gmail instantly readable.

Two possibilities for slowness: a problem of some sort in TBird when handling large imap emails; a difference in the IMAP server servicing their webmail (Outlook web app) and TBird as a client.

The corruption of emails of various types appears to be due to a vulnerability of TBird when handling slow/long downloads if a message is touched in some way between the header and completion of body download - - this could be the filter to move the mail, manual dragging of email by an impatient user, reading the mail through the web mail route. This has similarity to a problem a few years ago where TBird swapped headers and footers randomly - many people complained at that time. I recommend this is investigated

Meantime I shall pursue the ISP for more detail and will probably switch to their POP server if it still exists.

regards and thanks for help so far

.... and one last bit of news before I move on to POP trials.. Just back from the gym after an hour or so and the mails have been filtered across to the local inbox ... BUT they were both sent with 4 attachments (826K) and currently have 1 and 2 --- still downloading after nearly 3 hours. I didnt think the filter would move the mails until complete. https://support.cdn.mozilla.net/media/uploads/images/2015-12-02-04-28-59-22d5b5.png

In your images, i notice that you do not subscribe to see a load of folders on the server. You also seem to download and move everything into 'Local Folders' where you sort your emails into various folders.

So, I'm presuming you do not use the server folders for sorting your emails.

This leads me to think that you are not using the IMAP account as it was designed to be used. Perhaps you keep copies on the server for the pop mail account. When you move emails from imap folders to Local Folders, do you remove them off the server or leave the original on server?

IMAP accounts were designed to leave everthing on server, organise using server folders and then connect using various methods eg: phone, webmail and email clients to remotely view the same folders and emails. But I'm not so certain you use this imap account in that way - maybe you do?

The current method of downloading all mail from both POP and IMAP mail accounts and then moving everything into Local Folders where you read and manage them, sounds like POP may actually better suit your way of doing things. If you make your account server settings to 'Leave messages on server' then you will still be able to access emails via webmail if required.

The benefit of POP mail accounts is that they can be configured to auto send emails into what is called a deferred account or 'Global Inbox' setup. A Global Account using the Local folders Inbox means although you would see various maila ccounts in the Account settings window, you would only see 'Local Folders' in the folder pane. You would also not need any filtering as it would do it automatically. IMAP mail accounts cannot be set up as deferred accounts.

Info on Global accounts:

• http://kb.mozillazine.org/Global_Inbox

Newly created pop mail accounts can be set up from the start to use Global Inbox. Pop mail accounts that already exist need to be altered. Should you decide to try this......work through the steps as shown at link. Remember, pop mail accounts folders will become invisible, so make sure all emails are copied to Local Folder first. I would go into thunderbird's 'offline mode' to stop connecting with server whilst you go through the process. You do not want emails being downloaded whilst sorting out the Account Settings. You will also need to check the Message filters and stop the necessary ones that move email from Inbox to Local folders. After setting up Global account and checking Account Settings are all correct, you must exit and restart Thunderbird before going back into 'online' mode.

At the end of the day it is your choice, but I'm just showing you that there is another way of achieving the same result without setting up Message Filters.

Very helpful - thanks. Yes - I leave the mails on the server so that they are there as a backup should I accidentally delete something important, or if TBird has a 'moment'. I have now moved demon to its POP3 protocol at the same server. Large messages downloading in a few minutes with a sensible amount of 'green bar'. I used to have a lot of filters to separate work, family and other important stuff but not so much now. Not actually changed my way of working much in what must be getting on for 10 years since I moved over from SecretAgent to TBird ... but I'll take a look at this global inbox thingy.

Cheers

Today 5Dec.Global inbox set up and all on POP3. After 2 days away from home .... Read Messages ... 4 or 5 download slowly. 'no more messages' Click Read Messages -- a minute later, if that. 'Downloading 1 of 28 ... ' Many of which were from 3 and 4 Dec ( and which I knew about from the mobile phone) .... and about 12 downloaded a few minutes later Click read Messages ... another 5 messages a few hours ago download ( again already seen on phone some hours ago) There is definitely something odd about the way TB is getting mails from my ISP. I am hoping to get some online time with the ISP on Monday to see if they can shed any light on how TB is asking for data.